Talk about anything and everything Squad-related here -- what you've been playing, what you're looking forward to, and how big your Pile of Shame has grown after that last Steam sale...
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Grant Heaslip

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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Grant Heaslip » Fri Jan 02, 2015 10:13 pm

Angry Jedi wrote:I actually do think Xenoblade was underappreciated. Sure, it got the lion's share of coverage of all the Rainfall games, as you say, but it's still not anything like as well known as the latest and greatest big-budget stuff. And beyond that: how many people here have actually played it? (I have, and I know Beige and Rampant have.) By virtue of it being on Wii, I know that many, many people -- not just here but in the gaming community at large -- will have passed it by without a second thought, probably in favour of something that ran at HD resolutions.

Wii U gives you a chance to rectify that... assuming you can find a copy, that is, since the limited print run in the US also contributes significantly to the relatively small number of people who played it! I'm glad I jumped on it (and The Last Story/Pandora's Tower) the moment they were released.


I played Xenoblade and was kind of underwhelmed relative to media and enthusiast groundswell that sold me on it. I liked the environmental design, soundtrack, voice performances, and (at least to a point) the combat system, but I thought the plot, character development, side-quest design, and pacing were lacking. The character arcs (or lack thereof, in many cases) stand out as a bummer to me -- I found them unfulfilling and largely predictable. I didn't hate it -- I spent like 100 hours finishing it, after all -- but I continue to think the game's reception benefited a lot from the cult status afforded to it be the Operation Rainfall saga. To me, it's a B+ game that was hyped up to be an A+ game by people (in America) heavily invested in its release.
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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Angry Jedi » Fri Jan 02, 2015 11:59 pm

There's a certain amount of credit to be given for Xenoblade's hype, yes. I loved it and didn't have the same issues with it you had, with the exception of the sidequests -- RNG-based gathering quests aren't fun -- but it wasn't my favourite of the three Rainfall games.

I'm not actually sure if I liked The Last Story or Pandora's Tower more -- I think Pandora's Tower if only for its sheer ballsiness of concept and execution -- but I liked them both more than Xenoblade in the long term.

I keep meaning to replay all three of them. One day!
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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Alex Connolly » Sat Jan 03, 2015 12:17 am

Angry Jedi wrote:Quake! Fond memories indeed. I even made a mod for it. You could level up and get stronger. Unfortunately I made it so that once you got to about level 3 you could gib a Shambler in one hit with that pathetic shotgun you start with. Good times.


I really do miss the strange tone and ambience the game offered. It kinda returned in Painkiller, but traded out Quake's industrial-medieval grot for far more traditional pulp horror.

A true legend of a game.
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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by RedSwirl » Mon Jan 05, 2015 12:54 am

I just finished Saint's Row The Third. Wanted to get it out of the way before GTA V PC came out. It is Grand Theft Auto: Blood Dragon.

I've always had issues with the GTA games that seem to only be compounded by how slow Rockstar has been to address them and how few other people have those issues. I have none of these issues with Saint's Row. See, while GTA is a thematically excellent series of games with an often impressive sense of scale in its gameplay, I find the games some of the most mechanically frustrating on Earth. The PS2-era games are absolutely unplayable for me (I might try playing them with a keyboard sometime) and I only got through GTA IV with great frustration. It's like Rockstar's success has insulated the developer from the need to employ the mechanical standards of modern action games, and they're only just slowly getting around to it with Max Payne 3, Red Dead, and GTA V. The main reason I'm even hyped for GTA V is because it's the first game in the series with controls that are just normal enough for me to actually enjoy what everyone else has been enjoying for 10+ years. But even aside from that, I just haven't figured out how to reconcile how GTA's foundation of player freedom seems to clash with its scripted story sequences. Every time I try to laser focus on a singular task I accidentally do something (due to the clunky controls) that catches the attention of police which forces me to waste 15 minutes losing them and probably cancels whatever task I had going on. The same goes for trying to get somewhere or get away from someone in a car and getting waylayed by traffic and small pieces of geometry. From my perspective the game wants you do mess with all these things but it ends up messing with the well-written story campaigns Rockstar has written up.

Saint's Row The Third is the GTA clone that decided to not give a fuck and either change or get rid of just about anything that get's in the way of it being a fun game.

The police forget about me as soon as I enter a building or start a mission. Does it make sense? No. Does it make for a smoother gameplay experience? Yes. Whenever I want to I can call for someone to drop me a VTOL that looks like the ship from R-Type or something so I can fly it wherever I want. Doesn't make sense, but it's fun as hell to do. The game generally doesn't care if I shoot and run over random people, which is what most people do in GTA anyway. Same goes for the parachute I have on me at all times, or the nitrous boosters that suddenly appear on every vehicle I enter. From this and Blood Dragon, I feel like this is one of the smartest paths for action games that are trying to have super cereal storylines and subject matter that bog down gameplay that's completely ridiculous no matter what they do with it. I don't care of Ludonarrative dissonance is an overused term. It's still a real problem that has made AAA action games less interesting every year.

What Saint's Row The Third (and Blood Dragon) does has created another interesting phenomenon however when you compare it to Ubisoft's recent games. If you haven't noticed, just about every Ubisoft game since like 2009 has been basically the same game from a mechanical standpoint. You have an open world where you take over bases and sectors, engage in economic stuff, get notifications for anything of any significance you do, and level up. They've applied the Assassin's Creed II formula to Far Cry and Watch_Dogs while also putting parts of it in Rayman and even goddamn Tetris. On this very board we complain about the "skinner box" that AAA gaming has become.

Y'know what? Saint's Row The Third is the exact same skinner box. And Volition figured out how to actually make it fun.

You take over areas, get money automatically, and level up in some kind of perpetual feedback loop. The only real difference is, the activities you do at the base of it all are actually fun. Again, they make jack all sense, but make for fun video game activities. Insurance Fraud is genius. People like to mess around and crash into things so their own ragdolls fly around in the craziest ways. So, why not just make a minigame where you're invincible and get ragdolled for points with multipliers and all that? Mayhem is pretty much what people do in GTA anyway -- destroy things around them to get the police after them, then destroy all that too, but as an actual part of the game with points and multipliers on top. My favorite thing is Professor Genki -- a game show obstacle course that if you think about it for any amount of time is pretty much a play on Call of Duty corridor campaigns with chest-high walls, powerups, and arbitrarily "ethical" and "unethical" targets. Oh, and the stuff you unlock is actually new and interesting, like sonic weapons and flying motorcycles with chainguns.

On a superficial level you might see a lot of similarity between games like this, Blood Dragon, and say Wolfenstein The New Order, but I think there's a central difference with the former two. The former two came out of the era of action games trying to be serious and authentic, and then decided to stop trying after they'd gotten caught up in all the modernity of action game mechanics. Saint's Row and Blood Dragon are Call of Duty's philosophy loosened up by craziness. Wolfenstein on the other hand starts from the foundation of not giving a fuck in the first place. It instead builds itself up from the old early 90's era of action games, adding what it thinks it needs from today's games. I really do wish more games did that instead.

As for GTA. I think ultimately what's up with it and other recent sandbox games (especially Ubisoft's) is how much they try to cram linear campaigns into, well, sandbox games. GTA's foundation is supposed to be systemic and free-form, but it's slowly crafting stories and missions that are not. Maybe in the future someone should make a game like it that has no strict missions at all, only objectives. Just tell the player "find a way to do this thing," and let them play with the mechanics however they want in order to figure out how. That's basically what the Elite games are, and what No Man's Sky is trying to do, but in space.
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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Beige » Mon Jan 05, 2015 6:28 pm

Hey yall - back online after several weeks away from the Internet. Been kicking back with relations and friends, reading graphic novels, sleeping in and playing lots of both digital and board games (if you've seen me on Steam you already know this). My mother-in-law has been visiting us and she loves watching over our shoulder when Lynette and I do stuff. As a result, I tend to stockpile whimsical and/or narritive-ey games for this period of the year as Mom-in-Law prefers them to what she refers to as "blood and guts!" Orcs excepted, apparently.

Here's what's happeneing:

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Dungeon of the Endless:
Finished it, am pleased to see Bowley picking up the torch.

Middle Earth: Shadow of Mordor
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Received as a Christmas present from Mom-in-Law. Finished and 100%ed it over over the break to the enjoyment of all. Mom in law is a LOTR fan (movies anyway) so this one was an easy sell despite all the orc heads coming off in the margins, even Lynette enjoyed it. The game is as smooth and pretty as you've heard, IMO probably the best Assassin's Creed game to date. The AC / Batman stuff is perfectly servicable (and totally transparent) and the combat is refreshingly snappy in the Arkham mold, starts out challenging and then becomes a snorefest once you have lots of health and abilities and can just begin teleporting everywhere decapitating orcs willy nilly and blasting them with wraith fire. Whatever focus group determined that what gamers really want in games is to feel overpowered and invincible can jump off a bridge - Saints Row excepted. Mordor was ten times as fun when the orcs presented a legitimate threat. Running around, grabbing collectamables, doing side missions, parkouring everywhere. It's all smooth, good times.

A word on the Orcs, since was we all know they are the reason to show up for the party. I'd heard a lot of buzz about the Nemesis system going into this game and wasn't disappointed in the slightest to finally behold it in all its orcery. The raw expenditure of development resources on display in this one (albeit central) feature system is just staggering -- I wouldn't be surprised to find that more than 50% of the development budget for the entire game -- VO, art, programming -- was just spent on randomizing orcs, straight up. Would love to have been a fly on the wall during the recording sessions where the hundred-voiced male choir has to chant every single orcish name from a massive list over and over again just so that I can have that recurring moment where my nemesis strides out of the gates as his minions and thralls chant NAZ-DUG! NAZ-DUG! NAZ-DUG! (or PUG PUG PUG or whatever). Likewise, nailing a hated orc in the head with an arrow and then encountering that selfsame orc a few hours later with an eyepatch over the affected eye, spitting hate and fire and going on about how "no lucky shot is going to take him out of action THIS time!" is pure gold. There are a lot of orcs here guys. A lot. Fat orcs, skinny orcs, old orcs, bold orcs, yellow orcs, green orcs, teeny orcs, mesomorphic orcs... Orcs with flaming hats -- all with their own dialogue, unique modeling, character =-- again, staggering in developmental detail. Gruzh mad-eye does ineed have a mad watery white eye even though he's procedurally generated. Ulk the ancient has grey hair and withered skin, Nazgh the butcher shows up to the field wearing a butcher's apron, complete with butcher-specific taunts and callouts. Ulkuk the flayer opens confrontations with grisly commentary on how he's going to enjoy stripping the skin from my bones. Classic. Ultimately the AC/Batman elements of this game are total background radiation even though they form the gameplay DNA of the franchise. Orc Simulator 2015 is the reason to be here.

I do agree with the various commentators that say that plot-wise Mordor ultimately amounts to bad fanfiction in the LOTR world and that Tolkein is probably spinning like a dynamo in his grave as a result, which in my view probably disqualifies it from all the GOTY lists you're seeing it on. Even with the vague "You're going down the dark path, oh noes!" undertones of the game's writing, the moment-to-moment experience is pretty much 100 percent anti-Tolkein and anti-canon as can possibly be. Take the power of the Dark Lord, use it, abuse it and abuse it again to hurt people in consequence free ways all the while while blowing raspberries to the Tolkein canon of Celebrimbor etc. Boromir wishes he could appropriate dark power so effortlessly and without consequence and get away with it time and again. I wish that the developers had the spine to carry through on a more cautionary tale with the ultimate narrative -- as it stands it's massively irreverent to the entire philosophy and ethos of LOTR. Imagine an Indy game where Indy opened the ark and then walked around face melting nazis for MEGA KOMBOs for 2 hours.

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Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker

The little mushroom man once again makes a solid argument for the idea that that if you don't have a WiiU in 2015, you're doing it wrong. We actually used Toad as an orc chaser every time the blood and guts and Nazdugs got a little too orcy and we just wanted to kick back with xylophone and slide whistle music, bright colors and Nintendo cuteness. Toad apperitif.

I loved Treasure Tracker. Priced right, paced right, not too long, not too short. Not too difficult (I'm willing to bend here from my normal MO) not too soft once the actual game got rolling, maybe a third of the way through. My time with each of the game's stages was ~5-10 minutes per stage which is about right for the amount of time you can spend with a toy like this without getting bored. 50-70% of stages I finished (getting all the green stars) in a single run with the odd level requiring one or two replays to fully complete. Never onorous, the whole thing was a breezy, candy-colored ice cream. It's goofy and cute in the same way that all Nintendo stuff is, but experiencing it speaks volumes about Nintendo's ongoing commitment to just absolute top quality polish in all its titles, even weird one-off experiences like this one. A little on the easy side perhaps, but what do you want from a Toad puzzle games? No questions about recommending it to anybody looking for just abnegatey fun.


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Super Mario 3D World.

Not much to say about this one beyond the fact that, like Toad, Nintendo demonstrates once again that they're at the top of their game when it comes to designing fun platforming in 3D. Lynette and I have been hitting this over the last few days co-op, even though we aren't yet finished. Cat suit is OP but whatever -- it's still a blast to traverse around Nintendo's fascinating little environment dioramas, and damn don't everything on the Wii U look great? Nintendo has it made with this chibi soft Disney Infinity aesthetic, who needs photorealism? Bowswer really has this thing for capturing women doesn't he? Strange.

Sherlock Holmes: Crimes and Punishments

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Holmes came out of nowhere as probably the strongest single "Beige recommends" title I played during my holiday break, Mordor included. It's absolutely a different beast than Middle-Earth of course, being the latest evolution in Frogwares' ongoing attempts at creating detective adventure games under the Holmes brand and nothing like Assassin's Creed OR Batman. Holmes is a fairly unique beast - to the extent that it's anything you've seen before, I'd describe it as being sort of an amalgam of a Telltale game crossed with a Sierra adventure with a hefty dose of Phoenix Wright.

I'm very glad that we spent 2014 playing through the entire Frogwares catalog of Holmes adventures before Crimes and Punishments, as having the context of Nemesis, Jack the Ripper and Testament adds a lot of nuance and appreciation for just how far outside the safe zone the Ukranians went with this one. In case you don't already know, rather than one single 10-hour adventure as has been series convention, C&P is a collection of six different standalone Holmes cases, 2 adapted from the original Conan Doyle stories and 4 which are wholly new from Frogwares' brain. Each case is more or less "an evening's entertainment", clocking in at between 2 and 4 hours, so more like watching a movie on Netflix or playing a Telltale game. They aren't connected in any way beyond each one opening in 221B Baker Street as Holmes and Watson debate what they're going to do to alleviate boredom.

Frogwares has obviously been watching a lot of the BBC Sherlock over the last few years. Tons of stuff in this game reads very similar to the new series, with Holmes being depicted as just this side asbergers and borderline sociopathic yet still emminently sympathetic. Watson is there to be the brick that's there to contrast Holmes' loonyness.

I've said before that I'd like to play a detective game where someone pulls a gun only once, at the narratively appropriate moment. Holmes is very much that sort of game -- like Heavy Rain a little, except not all David Cage controller wiggling all the Time. The structure of the game sees you ramming around collecting evidence from crime scenes to build up a library of clues during each case which can ultimately be synthesized and condensed in Holmes' interactive mental map to arrive at multiple possible conclusions for each case. Was the presence of the loud sound significant or insignificant? Does the width of the tracks mean anything, and if so, what? How is this explained? Was there an accomplice? The game will ask you these questions but without overtly suggest the correct answer. Option A or B remain possible right up until you have to choose.

I really appreciate that the game so far seems to lean towards a structure where the last leg can be determined by environmental or contextual clues which point towards a definite "smoking gun" in each case, which is to say a clincher that helps you seal the deal on who to finger for the crime -- but that these clues are in no way highlighted to the player and that they require actual leaps of real-world brain-thinking logic and deduction. The clues are there, they're visible and understandible, but NOT explicitly told to you. The game goes to great lengths to make sure that you don't MISS things, but their inturpretation is left to you, the player. You must take that last leap -- the final 10% of logic which says "well, hang on... if there were THREE glasses on the table... and the door opens this way... and this character was standing here, as they claim.... that means...." on your own.

This is the master touch of C&P -- the fact that the game allows for multiple inturpretations of the facts, ultimately requiring you to think through the case yourself and stake a final verdict on whodunnit based on evidence. There is a "right" answer to each case, but the game allows you to be "wrong" in your decision as well, and it also asks the player to make an overt moral choice at the end of every case, after you've decided who the guilty party is. Pardon? Condemn? A little of each based on circumstance? Lynette and I have had fun butting heads over who we feel should go to the gallows and who should be left to walk free (without informing Scotland Yard) at the end of each case. Our moral choices do not always agree, but this is the nature of the game.

I also really appreciate how the game hand-holds you through the Sherlock-specific things that would be obvious to Sherlock Holmes but NOT obvious to you the non-holmes player when necessary. Pressing X to examine suspects and getting the whole "no wedding ring... unmarried... dirty clothes.... evidence of workman's calluses" never gets old. Holding down the IMAGINATION button likewise performs a wide variety of weird Holmesy miscellany including things like recreate the chronological events of a scene in real-time using phantom ghost-figures in Holmes' mind, or using smell to determine the origin of pipe tobacco, or playing chemistry minigames with evidence at 221B, or noticing insignificant little details in the environment that leap out as relevant to Holmes (there is a space on this shelf which is not as thick with dust... something was moved!) which would not be visibly obvious in-game even with the impressive graphics C&P sports.

Anyway, Holmes: Crimes and Punishments is fresh and fascinating. You should absolutely play it if you have any love for whodunnits or adventure games of any variety. The cases are diverse and interesting, the tone of Victorian London is pitch perfect (most of the time) and Holmes is wonderfully realized as an individual with strong voice acting and visuals throughout. The mechanic of assessing and assigning (potentially incorrect) blame in each case via evidence, as well as having to make a final moral decision about how to best dispense justice has kept us glued to the tube for many nights in a row. Play this game!

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The Talos Principle.

I also bought the Talos Principle. Haven't played it yet but heard only good things. I'll have an update when I do.
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Alex Connolly

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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Alex Connolly » Wed Jan 07, 2015 12:15 pm

Well, 2015 kicked off with a tasty little bang on Early Access.

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Behold, Project AURA.

It's been in alpha for a bit, and only just docked in Port Steam yesterday. In a Beige-style introduction, I proffer the following pitch:

- Did you play/like the busted but fascinating Outpost?
- Did you like Anno 2070?
- Did you want far more scientific granularity from Anno 2070?

If you answered 'yes' to any of the above, you *may* like the cut of Project AURA's jib. It's early and buggy in this post-Climate Change Disaster outpost manager, but by God, she's whispering all the right things in my ear. Deep supply chain/hard speculative science-fiction technologies. Colonist management with hierarchical chains, each with perks, job proficiencies and stats. Food menu creation. Plant and machine chaining. Stunning art direction and some very crisp sound design.

I know Early Access isn't particularly popular round here (you heathens), and I wouldn't recommended it to the bug-averse, but there's gold here - and it'll be on certain folks' radar, particular Bowls, Beige and the other lovely strat-heads of the Squad. Deep and wonderful, highly detailed, perfect high-concept stuff you only find on PC.

As you were.

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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Beige » Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:24 pm

We also saw this little beauty pop up on Steam right after the new year ticked over. I believe it got our attention enough that the wife "followed" it on its Steam page. Glad to hear that my first impulse seems correctly aligned -- I would absolutely count myself in the camp that loved Anno 2070 but would love it more with more science wankery and micromanagement.

I want to say there is another Early Access space colony sim on Steam we are following for the same reasons. Something... purple? Single word title... Shows promise but super rough around the edges. Maya? Something like that.
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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Alex Connolly » Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:40 pm

Maia, I do believe. Pete's the one to ask about that one, I do believe he's messed about with it.
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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Bowley » Wed Jan 07, 2015 3:54 pm

Beige wrote:
Here's what's happeneing:

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Dungeon of the Endless:
Finished it, am pleased to see Bowley picking up the torch.


What do you mean by you "finished" it? Also, I can barely get to the 5th floor in Sanitary Pod on "Easy", so that torch may burn out quickly. Which is fine, I think I've seen most of what Dungeon of the Endless has to offer, and I've got La Mulana daring me to boot it up. Out of the frying pan and into the fire, eh, old chap?

Talk about addicting though, Dungeon of the Endless has that Civ, "one more turn!" thing going on. One more door, one more floor! On top of that it's exactly what I want in terms of art design, music, mechanics, challenge, and overall polish. A lot of people are getting sick of the resurgence of games with pixel art, but I think DotE may have jump-started my love for it.
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Re: Whatchya Playin' - Brand New Digs Edition

by Beige » Wed Jan 07, 2015 7:47 pm

Oh, I just meant "Unlocked all the characters, made a few runs to level 13 on the legit difficulty mode, felt I got my money's worth". Unlike say, Rogue Legacy or Isaac, DotE doesn't exactly quote unquote "end".

I felt the same about FTL. Rabidly into it right up until I defeated the final mothership, screwed around with alternate ships for a bit, called it a day. I'm whatever psychological subset of gamer it is who finds purpose in discovering new content, making it "farther" each time, continually discovering more and more. Once I've seen all there is to see, I lose interest almost immediately.

No time for endlessly looping content Dr. Jones, or for games that are more systems based than progression based. Once I see you in your birthday suit, that's it. It's over. We're done.

Don't know where Isaac and soforth fit into this. Systems that slooooooooowly reveal more and more content over long periods of time. I suspect should I ever unlock all 300 items there, or in something like Risk of Rain, I'd be outsky.

Bowls, I am twitching with excitement to be the Elder Xelpud to your Lamezza, offering cryptic advice. If the Vita version of La-Mulana comes out in the next few months I may join you in a replay.
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